Some folks have been wondering why there hasn’t been any updates on our iPhone game “Heroes and Villains” recently. To be precise, “Wha happened?”
Do you guys and gals remember H+V? Here’s an uncut video of the latest build that never got released to jog your memory, or introduce you to the concept if you haven’t heard of it yet:
(also check out the work Chris and his voice acting friends did for the VAs)
The main stumbling block with releasing the game is that there are some interface problems. Right now its too hard for most people to pick up and play – which is a required aspect of iPhone games.
There’s also the question of being able to produce enough level content to make the game worthwhile. I wanted to aim for about 50 levels. There’s a fair amount of work involved in that, and I want to be sure that it’ll be worth the effort.
To whit, I’m employing the aide of some of my indie game developer friends – to have them assess, praise or destroy what I have in the game now, and hear how much potential they think it has. I think it’ll at the very least be educational; hopefully it’ll lead to the game improving and eventually being released.
For kicks, I’m also interested in finding out what you guys would like to see me spend my time on…
[poll id="2"]
Noyb wrote a Comment on June 4, 2009 at 3:07 am
Although I love puzzle games, I’m selfishly voting for Marian because I don’t see myself getting an iPhone in my near future.
alastair jack wrote a Comment on June 4, 2009 at 5:23 am
without a doubt Marian. go for it!
cmfnyc wrote a Comment on June 4, 2009 at 6:54 am
I’d love to see H+V land in the App Store. (I saw it as a puzzle game that even people who don’t really like puzzle games could enjoy.) Seems like you’ve already put a fair amount of work in it. Maybe it won’ t be everything you thought, but why waste what you have. My humble suggestion would be to shape what you have into a demo or $0.99 app. Encourage ideas and feedback from users. If you visit TouchArcade.com, you can see that the dev of Sparta: Lords of War has turned to user input to create a better app and probably generate a decent return in the App Store. Considering how many puzzle lovers there are out there, you never know what could happen.
For me, I wouldn’t worry about pick up and playability. If it has interesting elements, people will figure out how and where to play it.
Well, I can see from the poll votes that I’m in the minority, so I’m not going to hold out much hope. It would be a shame if H+V died. I liked what I saw and have had it on my watch list for months along with a few other indie games (like Caster). I’ll keep my fingers crossed.
If it never will see the light of day, but you have a demo copy of the unfinished game. I’d love to play it. If that would be OK.
robert wrote a Comment on June 4, 2009 at 8:07 am
“Maximum number of choices allowed: 2″ – Oh no!
Alec Holowka wrote a Comment on June 4, 2009 at 8:17 am
3: Thanks for the feedback! The poll probably won’t determine what I do, but its still interesting to consider.
Derek wrote a Comment on June 4, 2009 at 8:22 am
I second @cmfnyc comments. Get out what you have in a more minimal sort of way but don’t completely give up on it. You proved with Aquaria you can really pull off a story driven game. I think Marian sounds like it could be a most amazing story game.
Ivy wrote a Comment on June 4, 2009 at 10:18 am
Alec,
I’m busy trying to work past some similar issues in my own game. The player controls several characters, each of whom have one special skill that is used to solve puzzles. While it’s not an iPhone game, I would like it to be “casual-friendly.” I’ve re-done the whole interface at least once, and I’d be happy to tell you about the process (including the “banging head on desk” part).
IAfan wrote a Comment on June 4, 2009 at 11:08 am
i really would like to see h+v in the app store but i voted for marian not because i would want you to stop working on h+v but i was wondering if we’d be seeing anymore concept art
Alec Holowka wrote a Comment on June 4, 2009 at 12:01 pm
7: Ivy: Do tell!
8: IAFAN: I’d also like to see it released. I am still working on Marian, though. If all goes forward, we should see more about it at some point in the future. Its evolving slowly into something quite interesting…
Lestaticon wrote a Comment on June 4, 2009 at 3:13 pm
I think you should finish H+V and get it out there. iPhones are hot (right now) and this could generate some nice income.
Two Jacks wrote a Comment on June 4, 2009 at 6:29 pm
Who voted something else? I don’t think I can even comprehend what else Alec could be doing besides these awsome looking games! Still, I don’t have an iPhone so I voted Marian. I’d still like to see H+V finished with the hopes of a port someday.
Samantha wrote a Comment on June 4, 2009 at 7:57 pm
These iPeople must be pretty dumb.
PiSketch wrote a Comment on June 5, 2009 at 10:54 am
I would love to see Heros and Villains, but I voted Marian. Mostly because the idea and the concept art are both basically amazing, but also because if you released Heros and Villains I would have to rearrange everything on my iPod.
Seriously though, the stuff you’ve shown us about Marian just looks incredible. One of the few games where I would be buying it as soon as it was released.
Prab wrote a Comment on June 5, 2009 at 11:16 am
Arghhh…. I was really looking forward to H+V. Please continue working on it!!
day wrote a Comment on June 5, 2009 at 6:22 pm
take your time on h+v , you cant rush quality. the same with marian, take it one day at a time. i want both to see do well.. critical and.. commercial .
FellaDudeMan wrote a Comment on June 5, 2009 at 8:29 pm
Ooo! This is a rough choice. On one hand, I was really moved by you and Derek’s work for Aquaria, and have been really eager to see how you aimed to expand and develop that style of storytelling with Marian. However, on the flipside, the current selling point for Marian has been Katie’s beautiful artwork, which has already set a strong tone for how the game is being perceived. I think that at this point, your success with Marian is very strongly tied to your current relationship with Katie. You’d have to, “break from the strings” established so far to re-imagine the game without her right now, if that’s what may have to happen. I wonder how many people fully understand this notion. Even if you had another artist take over with a similar aesthetic to her work, the game could never meet it’s full potential as long as it’s made “in her shadow” and isn’t allowed to express itself freely. That’s a tough challenge to move on so soon, but I personally hope that you and Katie are still on good terms!
H+V is a bit different. It’s a very direct concept, and has already shared many hands in its development. Infact, it really needed to anyway! I think in your current situation, it may be easiest to continue this pattern with H+V, do like Derek is with Spelunky, and really get a lot of people you know involved in polishing and completing it. I think it has a lot of potential in its concept and visual approach, and can be a real hot item when completed to your standards. Also, from a presentation level, it may also be the easiest to backtrack on if you’re hesitant with some aspects of it based on past experiences. There are still a lot of ways the concept can be delivered if you end up needing to make some massive changes to the gameplay style. (For the record, I don’t own an iPhone, and the people I know only seem to own Blackberries, just letting you know)
Anyway, we know you’ll make the right choice. Just remember that these characters are depending on you too. Let their voices be heard by the masses!
Two Jacks wrote a Comment on June 5, 2009 at 11:01 pm
I think it’s best if H+V is released first. While it’s not the most anticipated, this actually works in IA’s favor. The traffic the game would bring in would bring in more Marian anticipaters which in turn spark more spreading of Marian’s existence. Also, will IA be working with Ambrosia Software at all for H+V?
16: What about Katie now?
Alec Holowka wrote a Comment on June 6, 2009 at 2:17 am
16: I don’t see that as being a problem, actually. For me, Marian is about the character, the story, the gameplay, the music and the underlying themes – and that was started long before anyone else got involved. I’ve been exploring it recently in gameplay and music, and to me that’s what is most compelling about the project.
Its basically a piece of my soul in game form. (as pretentious as that sounds) Part of its inspiration comes from a personal experience that severely affected my life.
Of course all that has been revealed to the public so far has been a couple images and one mp3 file, so I can understand why folks have a limited impression of it. Its actually a very personal project that I’ve been putting a lot of time into for a year now.
I can easily imagine the art being better – fitting more appropriately, being more stylistically interesting, more imaginative/creative. There are many different directions to take it that will be more rewarding to develop.
Its actually really liberating! I’m enjoying exploring the options, and I’m not going to move ahead on anything until it feels right. (the mistake that I made the first time)
Its going to take time and a lot of hard work, but its an idea that I find very powerful – and I’m going to give it the time it deserves to have a shot at being something great.
Alec Holowka wrote a Comment on June 6, 2009 at 2:22 am
15: I agree that rushing doesn’t necessarily help. Its best to keep up some kind of regular pace if possible.
This is something I learned the hard way. (by forcing myself to work as hard as possible and ending up burnt out)
Lesson Learned: Never underestimate the importance of good food, good company, regular exercise and deep sleep.
Unless its crunch time. >)
JacaByte wrote a Comment on June 6, 2009 at 5:31 pm
Marian, hands down, because I’m not going to get an iPhone anytime soon. Sorry!
Also, this is the first comment I’ve been able to make in 3 months. (If this works…)
Richard Boehme wrote a Comment on June 7, 2009 at 7:18 am
I think you should at least put what you have out there even if you’re not going to go much further on it. Also, I would really like to see this on Mac and Windows, so please build it for those platforms as well (as long as people can play it, I think the simple controls will still work for Mac and PC).
Robert Walker wrote a Comment on June 8, 2009 at 9:27 am
I voted for Marian mainly because it seems more interesting to me (and I don’t have an iPhone), but regarding H+V, maybe you can alleviate the interface problems by not throwing the whole interface at the user at once. Perhaps it might be possible to design levels such that you can introduce the interface concepts one at a time. Portal was really good at this; listening to the commentary is really enlightening.
Of course, you may already be doing that.
day wrote a Comment on June 16, 2009 at 10:53 pm
:19 do you guy’s work by the hour …or do just go to the office anytime ?
Alec Holowka wrote a Comment on June 17, 2009 at 2:13 pm
The way I work: I don’t really have set hours, but I end up working many hours during the day. I try to work when I’m feeling it and take breaks to hit the gym or visit friends when I’m not. (of course it doesn’t always sync up that way) Usually some kind of physical exercise helps focus.
I’ve learned that you can’t force yourself to work creatively too much – otherwise you come up with lame ideas.
Grunt work is different.
day wrote a Comment on June 17, 2009 at 3:44 pm
yea i know what you mean, i tried doing character design last night ..( force myself ) ..everything came out looking like shit ….lol
was it hard for you to get your team together ?
do you have a email or aim …..
Alec Holowka wrote a Comment on June 17, 2009 at 4:04 pm
I don’t work with a team per se, I like to collaborate with a lot of different people. So its like a different “team” per project.
I think that’s more manageable for a small indie group than having a forced role structure, set hours, etc.
The linchpin is finding hardworking, self-motivated people to collaborate with – and that’s not easy. Fortunately I know a lot of great people in the indie game scene and I’m working on a few collaborations with them.
Hint: http://www.flickr.com/photos/infiniteammo/3595988484/
day wrote a Comment on June 17, 2009 at 9:51 pm
very start move,doing collaboration is what the US/main stream needs more of.
( that and some creative juice )
i have a team of three but its VERY HARD getting everyone to come together. lol
thanks for replying, i ask cuz iam trying to jump in the indie movement ( easier said then done ) i been hoping on tigsource forums etc
i think i found the email …lol ..let me know if you got it ….lol
Eric J wrote a Comment on November 17, 2009 at 8:31 pm
… so is this still on ice?